Strakon's initial comments on the "hate group" smear.
Comment from TLD readers.
The Hate Department.
"Things always are more complex
than they first appear."
What lessons do we learn
from this, comrades?
Following is the unedited text of my e-mail correspondence with Miss Cassiel Sophia, Webmaster of the MetaReligion site.
While I am not prepared, of course, to ignore the matter altogether, I am unenthusiastic about extending our correspondence further because I don't believe it can ultimately prove productive from my standpoint. Time is short and all men are mortal and I have much more promising things to do. Also, I have to say that I find my exchanges with Miss Sophia to be somewhat disorienting. As an old Randian, I try to avoid long-distance "psychologizing" of my intellectual adversaries, relying instead on reasoned argument. But in respect to this entire imbroglio with MetaReligion I feel like a man suddenly accosted by a stranger who first screams obscenities at him and then proceeds calmly to discuss the weather.
Suffice it to say that a sufficiently bad ideology can be hard to distinguish from genuine sociopathy.
August 25, 2002
August 23, 2002
Subject: That "hate group" designation for The Last Ditch
I recently discovered that you had listed my Website, The Last Ditch (http://www.thornwalker.com/ditch), on your site as a "hate group." Without wanting to get into a substantive exchange of views which would probably be unprofitable for both of us I thought I should write and just ask a couple of questions.
I now have to add a couple of new questions, because today (8/23) I no longer seem to be able to find the link to TLD among your "hate groups." So the new questions are: Has it been removed? If so, why (assuming it's not a secret)?
Old questions: I'd be obliged if you could tell me whether your original listing of TLD was on account of our primary content, our links to other sites, or perhaps a characterization of TLD as hateful by another Website or by a reference work. If you did pick up the characterization from somewhere else, I'd appreciate knowing where, again assuming that it's not a secret.
Thanks for your attention to these matters.
Editor-in-chief, The Last Ditch
August 24, 2002
First of all, thank you for your polite email (considering our differences of opinion) When I received the first visit from your site I was surprised. First of all, because your site content doesn't not quite falls in the "Hate category". I found this site listed in the World Church of the Creator (www.wcotc.com racist site clearly) but I think is not longer there. I tried to remember exactly where I found it, because it was a long list of sites and most of them where Neonazi, Christian Identity, revisionist or something like that. But I couldn't find the list again.
I must confess I didn't checked the site thorough before. I assumed all in this list where easily classified in this area, but things always are more complex than they first appear. Anarchy and revolutionary ideas does cause hate ideas, but not so directly as racial or nazi ideas. I did find some racial issues in the texts your site. And to be sincere with you I must say your site has some components of hate. But at the same time I most aknowledge this is a simplification of your ideas. Some of your ideas are in fact interesting, but people will always take note of the obscure racial issues the site has included in many texts.
But the link has not been removed. http://www.meta- religion.com/Directory/hate_groups_links.htm. If you consider this classification to be wrong, be free to guide me to understand better your philosophy. After all, we mexicans are the product of a revolution (back in 1910).
August 24, 2002
Dear Miss Sophia:
Thanks for answering my inquiries so promptly and fully.
I received a couple of e-mails today from readers noting that the link still exists on the MetaReligion site. Earlier I had found on your site what I took to be an updated, redesigned "hate" page (I didn't record the URL), much more graphically laden than the first one I saw several days ago, with all the links grouped under subheads. That more-elaborate page included neither the link to TLD nor the link to American Renaissance. So I assumed they had been removed. Apparently, though, the "hate" page I first saw is still up and running on your site.
As I noted in my first communique, I don't think it would be profitable for us to engage in a discussion on the merits. I am certainly not inclined to defend myself against any preposterous accusations about "hate" first, because it's beneath my dignity to do so, and, second, because I don't understand what qualifies as "hate" in the eyes of today's progressive cognoscenti. For example, although both the Israeli and United States governments have established long histories of murdering civilians though bombing and other means, it seems those entities never qualify for inclusion on any list of "haters." Perhaps such mass murder is, in fact, motivated not by hate but rather by love and compassion. But in any case, I'm sure you will understand my confusion.
August 25, 2002
I have made some changes to the following pages titles to clarify my position. Since many Nazi and Militia groups include anarchy ideas I changed the title to "Hate and Anarchy groups". In this way people will be aware there could be all grades of shades of this ideas, including total anarchy. I think this will do more justice to your site. People will have to decide how to classify the sites after reading their content.
I changed the position of the TLD and American Renaissance to Anarchy. I will verify all sites included in the list and reclassify them accordingly.
August 25, 2002
Dear Miss Sophia:
Nazi anarchists, eh? That's a new one for me, and I am something of a minor-league scholar of the history of anarchism.
If you don't wish to, I will advise Mr. Jared Taylor of American Renaissance that AR is now considered anarchistic. He will be interested to discover that.
You may look for some analysis of our exchange yours and mine on the TLD site in the near future.
Did you find this exchange at all educational? If you think it was worth a couple of bucks, please hit the PayPal logo and take it from there. Anything would be most appreciated we're quite serious about that "couple of bucks" and would help assure a future for TLD.
If you'd like to see your brief comments posted on the site, please respond here.
All comments will be subject to the usual editing, and we will be looking for those that are the most thought-provoking, pro or con. And we would be interested in knowing about any other "TLD hate" sightings on the Web.
Notice to visitors who came straight to this document from off site: You are deep in The Last Ditch. You should check out our home page and table of contents.